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Author Topic: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG  (Read 2077 times)

davy

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #240 on: August 25, 2017, 09:13:29 AM »

TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG

There's no seering in this game, so colors are just for convenience.

Wolves
1. Breaking the rules - Can wolf a player during the night phase. If he wolves a player, Inactivity cannot use its power during the same night phase.
2. Inactivity - Cannot wolf. Each night phase can target one player, except himself or Breaking the rules. That player loses his vote. If Inactivity uses its power, Breaking the rules cannot wolf during the same night phase. During the day phase, Inactivity can opt to have its voting power changed based on the amount of times it succesfully caused a player to lose its vote:
        0 times: vote counts for 1
        1 time: vote counts for 1,01
        2 times: vote counts for 2,01
        3 times or more: Any vote he casts immediately causes an insta on the player Inactivity voted for, and other players' votes can't cause insta's.

Humans:
3. TWC Member - Known for his abuse of power frivolousness, he can ban (=vigi) one player each night phase. Additionally, during any phase, but one time only, he can post the name of a player that was vigi'd followed by 'that ban was just a joke, also, frivolous.' to revive that player at the end of the phase.
4. Host - In an attempt to keep his game alive he can convince a player to keep playing (=guard) each night phase. This protects them from both Inactivity and Breaking the rules. Cannot guard self. Each time he guards a player that was also guarded the night phase before, a random human other than the host and the guarded player loses his vote, because the game is no fun if the host has favorites. This loss of votes doesn't count towards Inactivity's voting power, unless Inactivity targets the same player at any point in the game.
5. Player
6. Player
7. Player
8. Player


Role PM's
Breaking the rules
You are Breaking the rules. I mean, you have the role Breaking the rules. If I catch you breaking the rules, you will be kicked out of the game, even though you are Breaking the rules.

NAME is Inactivity.
[close]
Inactivity
You are Inactivity. That is not an excuse to be inactive.

NAME is Breaking the rules, well, I mean, that's his role, not his current activity.
[close]
TWC Member
You are the TWC Member. It is your duty to provide a structural base for the subforum, to make sure things don't get out of hand and to govern the subforum with knowledge and experience. Or you can just go trigger happy and ban everyone.

Frivolous.
[close]
Host
You are the host. Wait, no, I am the host. You just have the role Host. You can convince people to keep playing, but try to not have favourites, that might backfire.
[close]
Player
You are a Player. You should really stop having all those one-night stands, though.
[close]
[close]



1. Olimar12345
2. BlackDragonSlayer
3. NocturneOfShadow
4. E. Gadd Industries
5. Dudeman
6. BrainyLucario
7. Trasdegi
8. mastersuperfan



Insta! Day 2 is over. Trasdegi was lynched after Olimar's vote. It's now night 3. Night 3 ends August 26th 1:00AM PST, 2:00AM MST, 3:00AM CST, 4:00AM EST, 10:00AM CET. That's 24 hours from now.
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Quote from: NocturneOfShadow
[davy]'s in a way different time zone so basically he pops in at like 2 AM and posts 500 words and wins the game

Olimar12345

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #241 on: August 25, 2017, 01:10:09 PM »

SHIT SHIT GUYS WE ARE VERY CLOSE TO LOSING/WINING. One wolf is left. The fact that Trasdegi was lynched before their own vote means that inactivity is definitely our last wolf, since it's statistically more plossible that inactivity would have been on the wining side of the lynch, causing an insta before the final vote was cast.

This is actually a blessing in disguise, since we can kill them TONIGHT and they cannot win until the next phase. However, if we do not vigi the correct player now, the wolf will gain insta voting powers and will kill egadd tomorrow. With that said, it is in everyone's best interest to VIGI MSF.

Here are some flashbacks of things MSF has done that in hind site might look different:

The chatlog between him and Noc that started the Noc lynch bandwagon was started by him asking Noc if they knew who the host was. Inquiring about the host at that time was not something that a human needed to know, as I described in my posts well before that:

http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?topic=9571.msg383228#msg383228

http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?topic=9571.msg383231#msg383231

http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?topic=9571.msg383234#msg383234

Etc. (basically only wolves would have a reason to learn who the host was so that they could kill them)

My humanity should be pretty clear by the way I've been approaching various situations in the game. Let's take this for example: Rather than just go with the flow when claims were being sent around, I verbally posted about my concern and displayed the odds for other possibilities so that it could be clear for the public to see (if it wasn't already). Here are a couple examples:

Egadd:

...I believe that Egadd is basically confirmed as the TWC at this point. If our actual host says that activity has been good then we can use that to say that all of our special roles played last night. This means that there was one wolf activity and two special human abilities (guard and vigi) used. Egadd claimed twc and vigi'd someone (brainy) and the host guarded someone (most likely egadd, but def. not brainy). Since brainy was the only death, this means one of a few things happened...

BDS:

Ran the odds in the chat earlier and not only does it check out with them, it's more plausible. Log:
Spoiler
...
[8:33 PM] Olimar12345: well I'm not sure how much we can trust BDS's claim, since we have several players dead, but if it's legit, then that leaves me trasdegi and msf.
[8:34 PM] mastersuperfan: did E. Gadd reveal previously that the host had claimed to him? I know he did to me privately
[8:34 PM] mastersuperfan: because if so then a counterclaimed would've happened if BDS wasn't legit (and if not, then a counterclaim would probably happen now)
[8:34 PM] Olimar12345: when did BDS claim to you, @E. Gadd Industries ?
kappa1
[8:34 PM] mastersuperfan: a counterclaim*
[8:34 PM] Golden Silver: The first day.
kappa1
[8:35 PM] Olimar12345: @diechael what is this now
[8:35 PM] mastersuperfan: kappa
[8:35 PM] diechael: Kappas for sarcasm
[8:35 PM] diechael: Lighten the mood
[8:35 PM] diechael: Keep it fun
[8:35 PM] mastersuperfan: lol
[8:35 PM] E. Gadd Industries: Can confirm, BDS claimed D1
[8:35 PM] Golden Silver: i kept laughing when people said "host should claim to egadd" because i was like "i'm way ahead of you"
[8:35 PM] Golden Silver: "way, way ahead of you"
kappa1
[8:35 PM] mastersuperfan: lol
[8:36 PM] E. Gadd Industries: XD
[8:38 PM] Olimar12345: huh. I'm still skeptical tbh. I'm not sure how we could really prove that since it was announced in the topic to not claim to egadd
[8:39 PM] mastersuperfan: I think if BDS wasn't the host then it would have been too risky to fake claim to E. Gadd D1
[8:39 PM] E. Gadd Industries: I mean, he still did it XD
Also true^
[8:39 PM] Golden Silver: I didn't claim to him the moment he claimed; I waited until he actually vigi'd somebody.
Sidon1
[8:39 PM] Olimar12345: but there is that @mastersuperfan
[8:40 PM] Olimar12345: @Golden Silver so you waited until the first day phase?
[8:40 PM] Golden Silver: The only time I saw "host don't claim to e. gadd" was when his claim was unconfirmed.
[8:40 PM] Golden Silver: Yes, that's what I said. Day 1.
[8:41 PM] Olimar12345: sry, I though you meant that as a thing for "asap"
[8:41 PM] Olimar12345: so after the first night phase
[8:41 PM] Olimar12345: covering my bases here, but what if brainy was the host
[8:42 PM] Olimar12345: and never counterclaimed
[8:42 PM] Olimar12345: and bds is a wolf
[8:42 PM] Golden Silver: That's incredibly unlikely. Just saying.
[8:42 PM] E. Gadd Industries: Then why am I still alive?
[8:42 PM] Olimar12345: hypothetically speaking here
[8:42 PM] Olimar12345: because not killing you would be the perfect way to make you think he was the host?
[8:42 PM] Olimar12345: idk
[8:43 PM] Golden Silver: Yeah, if I was a wolf, I could have killed E. Gadd without anybody even knowing that I claimed.
[8:43 PM] Olimar12345: yeah that's pretty far fetched
[8:43 PM] E. Gadd Industries: Eh, it's plausible, but so unlikely that I wouldn't consider it
[8:43 PM] Olimar12345: so it seems more likely that you would be the host, @Golden Silver
...
[close]

Also, it's still very likely that I was one of the players who was targeted and lost a vote on night 1. If you'll recall, the Noc-DM vote ended in a dudeman lynch but not an insta (even with the insta number of voters present), indicating that either Noc, myself, egadd, or trasdegi lost a vote. It should be apparent that I was not a wolf trying to intentionally get on the safe side of the vote, since I was the first person to vote dudeman. My vote was only ever changed (temporarily removed) to prevent an accidental insta, should a better lynch candidate have surfaced. MSF did not end up casting a vote during this phase, so if you like numbers, I literally have a 1/4th chance of statistically being a wolf target while msf does not.

Also, if you'll go back and reread the day one lynch, you'll notice that msf was actually on the opposite side of the vote loss target. In fact, the smoke-and-mirrors lynch against Noc (that msf started) was just one vote away from an insta until I mentioned it publicly, in which he removed his vote entirely (the whole situation looked like a wolf setup in a sense).

Like I've said before, there isn't too much to go on for much of us here, but from what little we have it should be obvious that msf is the way to go here for our vigi. Think hard about this egadd, don't let simple private chats/personal reasons cloud good judgement.
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Olimar12345

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #242 on: August 25, 2017, 01:19:02 PM »

Oh wait, duh, my vote was not lost-the lynch ended with my vote. This means that egadd (with the same possibilities as me I just realized) was inactivity-targeted, as well as possibly BDS. That or inactivity did not use their extra voting ability intentionally, since it would not be needed after we agreed on a target that wasn't them.
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mastersuperfan

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #243 on: August 25, 2017, 04:37:52 PM »

The chatlog between him and Noc that started the Noc lynch bandwagon was started by him asking Noc if they knew who the host was. Inquiring about the host at that time was not something that a human needed to know, as I described in my posts well before that:

Etc. (basically only wolves would have a reason to learn who the host was so that they could kill them)

I had no interest in knowing who the host was, nor did I ask Noc that. I wanted to see whether or not I could catch him out lying--and I did, which led me to believe that he was a wolf because a human would not have a good reason to lie like that. Asking if Noc knew who the host was but not about the host's identity would give me no benefit as a wolf--unless you mean to say that this was all a scheme to get an incriminating chatlog for me to start this whole "smoke-and-mirrors lynch," but there was absolutely no way I could have predicted that Noc would have acted like that, especially if I was a wolf and knew he wasn't a wolf. In short, a wolf would have no reason to act like I did towards Noc.

Secondly, I'll reiterate this part of the chatlog:

Quote
[9:03 PM] Olimar12345: And not to rustle everyone's jimmies, but why is msf generally accepted as cleared? I know it's not much of an argument, but from my perspective the wolf is either MSF or tras (or both if we're incredibly unlucky). BDS and egadd were cleared already due to circumstantial odds being in their favor, so msf is (or should be) in the same boat as me and tras. I've yet to play a game with msf so the lack of seeing how he plays worries me.
[9:04 PM] Olimar12345: It's weird because I don't really have suspicions for either, but with the other two confirmed, from my pov it's one of them.
[9:04 PM] Golden Silver: A lot of his early actions seem human, including one that you pointed out about the fact that the vote cancelling wolf can choose to activate their increased vote or not.
[9:05 PM] Golden Silver: Something that would be in the absolute best interest of a wolf to NOT bring up.
[9:05 PM] Golden Silver: So they can trick the humans into causing a massive KitB.

Not that I can say for sure because I'm not in the shoes of the wolf, but I imagine that if I were I might've easily been able to have this game the bag already had I not pointed this out. This is also something that Olimar did not point out in his first posts about Inactivity's strategy, and he claimed not to have noticed it after I pointed it out--indicative of the possibility that he was the one trying to trip the humans up here.

As I must, I will lastly state: vigi Olimar. He is the remaining wolf.
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Olimar12345

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #244 on: August 25, 2017, 05:07:49 PM »

I had no interest in knowing who the host was, nor did I ask Noc that. I wanted to see whether or not I could catch him out lying--and I did, which led me to believe that he was a wolf because a human would not have a good reason to lie like that. Asking if Noc knew who the host was but not about the host's identity would give me no benefit as a wolf--unless you mean to say that this was all a scheme to get an incriminating chatlog for me to start this whole "smoke-and-mirrors lynch," but there was absolutely no way I could have predicted that Noc would have acted like that, especially if I was a wolf and knew he wasn't a wolf. In short, a wolf would have no reason to act like I did towards Noc.

I find this hard to believe. You're trying to tell me that you were trying to see if you could catch Noc, the guy who's first post in the game was a lie, was lying? Even if you didn't know that at the time of noc posting that, it should have been WELL known by the first day phase, especially after many more posts by him in the same style that frustrated you and dudeman.

Secondly, noc had a really good reason to lie to you and it was the same as yours (only better because you weren't playing as risky as noc was). Your interest of his knowledge of the host's identity would be a suspicious thing to inquire about in the first place, since like I already mentioned, humans had no good reason to know that. How could noc, or ANY sane human player resist a conversation like that out of the blue. In his shoes it was an opportunity to catch you slipping up.

Thirdly, how could you have not predicted that noc would have acted similar to that after how he had acted prior to that? Even if you hadn't played with him before, he made his playstyle apparent since night one.

Secondly, I'll reiterate this part of the chatlog:

Not that I can say for sure because I'm not in the shoes of the wolf, but I imagine that if I were I might've easily been able to have this game the bag already had I not pointed this out. This is also something that Olimar did not point out in his first posts about Inactivity's strategy, and he claimed not to have noticed it after I pointed it out--indicative of the possibility that he was the one trying to trip the humans up here.

Sure you could interpret that as such, but like I said previously: those kinds of arguments can go both ways. He could have easily pointed that out, playing either extremely well (knowing that saying something like that would be interpreted as a "human" thing to post) or playing poorly (accidentally saying it because of more familiarity with his own role).

MSF is our remaining wolf. Do not be fooled.


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BlackDragonSlayer

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #245 on: August 25, 2017, 07:18:12 PM »

The chatlog between him and Noc that started the Noc lynch bandwagon was started by him asking Noc if they knew who the host was. Inquiring about the host at that time was not something that a human needed to know
I don't see that as "inquiring about the host," but rather, ascertaining whether or not Noc was lying... which he was. E. Gadd even called him (Noc) out for the same thing. That chatlog doesn't seem like he's trying to find out the host's identity at all, but rather, like I said, to try and squeeze (or rather, glean, I should say) as much information out of Noc (about Noc) as possible. Considering I pretty much did the same thing (except slightly less drastic, as I was trying to hide my identity as much as possible), I saw no fault in what MSF did at all, and still see no fault.

Quote
In fact, the smoke-and-mirrors lynch against Noc (that msf started) was just one vote away from an insta until I mentioned it publicly, in which he removed his vote entirely (the whole situation looked like a wolf setup in a sense).
i'm about 99% sure the noc lynch was in motion loooooong before msf voted for noc
like
literally the moment he falseclaimed was when i wanted to lynch him

If you want to be specific, Dudeman was the person to place the first vote on Noc, and I was probably the first person to want to lynch Noc, being the guardian and all, and seeing Noc falseclaim. I'm not sure what MSF has to do with either of those factors, so it seems like a bit of a stretch, to say the least.



Also, I'm starting to think that either Brainy was the wolfing wolf (and was killed) or that one of the wolf kills was blocked (which would have to be the one on E. Gadd, though it doesn't make as much sense why they'd go for him when he was so likely to be guarded; I'm guessing the logic would be "the guardian is totally going to try and fake us out and only guard him next phase" or something like that?).
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And the moral of the story: Quit while you're a head.

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E. Gadd Industries

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #246 on: August 25, 2017, 11:14:37 PM »

Guise, I have confession. Am wolf all along. Rawr. :P

In all seriousness, though, the PM was sent, and it's not changing now.
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The entrance to my lab is hidden... somewhere...
Spoiler

[close]

Olimar12345

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #247 on: August 25, 2017, 11:26:27 PM »

Welp for the sake of our victory, I hope you know what you're doing.
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Olimar12345

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #248 on: August 26, 2017, 12:08:53 AM »

In b4 somehow you're all wolves
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E. Gadd Industries

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #249 on: August 26, 2017, 12:10:29 AM »

Dangit, you found me
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Spoiler

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BlackDragonSlayer

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #250 on: August 26, 2017, 04:42:27 AM »

Welp, we can only wait and hope.
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davy

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #251 on: August 26, 2017, 09:11:51 AM »

TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG

There's no seering in this game, so colors are just for convenience.

Wolves
1. Breaking the rules - Can wolf a player during the night phase. If he wolves a player, Inactivity cannot use its power during the same night phase.
2. Inactivity - Cannot wolf. Each night phase can target one player, except himself or Breaking the rules. That player loses his vote. If Inactivity uses its power, Breaking the rules cannot wolf during the same night phase. During the day phase, Inactivity can opt to have its voting power changed based on the amount of times it succesfully caused a player to lose its vote:
        0 times: vote counts for 1
        1 time: vote counts for 1,01
        2 times: vote counts for 2,01
        3 times or more: Any vote he casts immediately causes an insta on the player Inactivity voted for, and other players' votes can't cause insta's.

Humans:
3. TWC Member - Known for his abuse of power frivolousness, he can ban (=vigi) one player each night phase. Additionally, during any phase, but one time only, he can post the name of a player that was vigi'd followed by 'that ban was just a joke, also, frivolous.' to revive that player at the end of the phase.
4. Host - In an attempt to keep his game alive he can convince a player to keep playing (=guard) each night phase. This protects them from both Inactivity and Breaking the rules. Cannot guard self. Each time he guards a player that was also guarded the night phase before, a random human other than the host and the guarded player loses his vote, because the game is no fun if the host has favorites. This loss of votes doesn't count towards Inactivity's voting power, unless Inactivity targets the same player at any point in the game.
5. Player
6. Player
7. Player
8. Player


Role PM's
Breaking the rules
You are Breaking the rules. I mean, you have the role Breaking the rules. If I catch you breaking the rules, you will be kicked out of the game, even though you are Breaking the rules.

NAME is Inactivity.
[close]
Inactivity
You are Inactivity. That is not an excuse to be inactive.

NAME is Breaking the rules, well, I mean, that's his role, not his current activity.
[close]
TWC Member
You are the TWC Member. It is your duty to provide a structural base for the subforum, to make sure things don't get out of hand and to govern the subforum with knowledge and experience. Or you can just go trigger happy and ban everyone.

Frivolous.
[close]
Host
You are the host. Wait, no, I am the host. You just have the role Host. You can convince people to keep playing, but try to not have favourites, that might backfire.
[close]
Player
You are a Player. You should really stop having all those one-night stands, though.
[close]
[close]



1. Olimar12345
2. BlackDragonSlayer
3. NocturneOfShadow
4. E. Gadd Industries
5. Dudeman
6. BrainyLucario
7. Trasdegi
8. mastersuperfan



Night 3 is over. Olimar was banned by the TWC.


TWG wasn't killed that means humans win
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Quote from: NocturneOfShadow
[davy]'s in a way different time zone so basically he pops in at like 2 AM and posts 500 words and wins the game

Trasdegi

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #252 on: August 26, 2017, 10:07:58 AM »

Yeah! We won!

NocturneOfShadow

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Re: TWG XCIV: How to Kill TWG
« Reply #253 on: August 26, 2017, 02:43:29 PM »

tras avatar very fitting here
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