[GBA] The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap - "Mt. Crenel" by NocturneOfShadow

[Zeta]

Submission Information:
Series: The Legend of Zelda
Game: The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap
Console: Game Boy Advance
Title: Mt. Crenel
Instrumentation Solo Piano
Arranger: NocturneOfShadow

[Maelstrom]

-Please, please use "L" to flip your note stems. Measures 11 and 12 are illegible.
-In more than a few places, your layers overlap, and badly. Rests should not be on top of notes.
-I feel that the short crescendo is unnecessary.
-Yes, notepad can do text formatting. Please review this.
-Maybe ask someone with finale to add some 8vb markings.
-It sounds pretty accurate.

[mikey]

-Please, please use "L" to flip your note stems. Measures 11 and 12 are illegible.
-In more than a few places, your layers overlap, and badly. Rests should not be on top of notes.
-I feel that the short crescendo is unnecessary.
-Yes, notepad can do text formatting. Please review this.
-Maybe ask someone with finale to add some 8vb markings.
-It sounds pretty accurate.

I'm not sure how to fix the rests and overlaps.  But I can do everything else.

[Maelstrom]

Not sure if it works on notepad, but L is the shortcut for flipping note stems. You may need to push it once for each note in the bar.
To change where the rest is, select it and push the up or down arrow to reposition it.

[Bespinben]

Nocturne's first arrangement! Not bad. Not bad.

I don't want to rob you of the joy of self-evaluation, so instead of overhauling this myself (as has been my manner with some), I'm going to give you some pointers:

1.) Listen through the original song very carefully, and write in those harmonies you missed. They really bring a lot to the OOMPH of the C dorian (that's right it's not minor!). Some specific places include measures 1-4 (the long string tones), m. 12 (the sycopated trumpet line), m. 17-18 (string backings behind the melody), and elsewhere.

2.) This is a quick fix. Clean up the LH ostinato a bit. There are places where the Eb in the upper layer of it don't gel with the voices in the RH, and when it does fit in the harmonic framework, it's still texturally very gritty (not a good thing). It's an interpretation of the percussion after all, so IMO I'd say just omit the Eb entirely.

3.) Kinda along the same vein as maelstrom, the organization of the layers needs attention. I'm pretty sure Notepad will let you flip stems with L. There are a few places where you could easily clean up the cluttered feel by combining everything into one layer (ex: measure 5).

[mikey]

Nocturne's first arrangement! Not bad. Not bad.

I don't want to rob you of the joy of self-evaluation, so instead of overhauling this myself (as has been my manner with some), I'm going to give you some pointers:

1.) Listen through the original song very carefully, and write in those harmonies you missed. They really bring a lot to the OOMPH of the C dorian (that's right it's not minor!). Some specific places include measures 1-4 (the long string tones), m. 12 (the sycopated trumpet line), m. 17-18 (string backings behind the melody), and elsewhere.

2.) This is a quick fix. Clean up the LH ostinato a bit. There are places where the Eb in the upper layer of it don't gel with the voices in the RH, and when it does fit in the harmonic framework, it's still texturally very gritty (not a good thing). It's an interpretation of the percussion after all, so IMO I'd say just omit the Eb entirely.

3.) Kinda along the same vein as maelstrom, the organization of the layers needs attention. I'm pretty sure Notepad will let you flip stems with L. There are a few places where you could easily clean up the cluttered feel by combining everything into one layer (ex: measure 5).

1) I picked up on that   I just put the key signature in G minor because I didn't see a need to natural every single A.  But I will look through the harmony again.
2)Personally I feel like the "grittiness" as you called it sort of brings out the feel of scaling a rough crenellated mountain, but if you think the Eb doesn't work as well as I do then I guess I can change that.
3) I'll work on that, I swear!!

[mikey]

Maybe I'm just weird like that but I like the Eb in the ostinato

[FierceDeity]

(I'll also try not to be too specific, because as bespinben said, self-evaluation is great, and super important for improving as an arranger! But I'll mostly just be omitting pitch-specific instructions, because there are certain things I can see being hard to figure out without being told. The pitches, I'm sure you can hear if you know where to listen for it.)

On the Eb in the ostinato: Ehhhhh. I had to listen to the original to be sure, but yeah, that's very harmonically misleading. It's strange to include a pedal note where there wasn't originally one, let alone a whole triad (well, the dyad is really what isn't there). It'd be one thing if what you're emulating had a distinct, yet not specifically tuned pitch (such as a tom tom), but when emulating snare, it's best not to interfere with the harmony at all. It's not just the Eb that I'd change, to be honest; it may not be apparent from what you've notated, but that G is clashing even more with the harmony than the Eb is (the Eb could be written off as a seventh; the G is a ninth, in the original harmony!) Definitely reconsider that percussion interpretation to go along with the actual harmony. The harmony will be much clearer once you fix the second note in the timpani line; it changes to a different note every two measures up until measure 17 (and in the measures where it would be different, it's especially important, because it's the root of the chord).

Some more specific things:

-This one's actually a pretty glaring issue for not having been pointed out yet; you're missing an entire measure before it repeats back to measure 5.

-As far as layers and stem direction go, while 11 and 12 are super messy, it's at least kinda clear what's meant. Measures 5 and 6, however, are in need of a little more help. While the rules of tying notes versus using the full value can get pretty messy, here's a general guideline to go by: only cross a note over the center of a measure if it both starts on and ends on a beat. This means that half notes started on beat 2, as well as dotted half notes started on beat 1 or 2, are fine. However, a dotted quarter note initiated on beat 2 is pretty nonstandard, and especially confusing to read with all of this layering going on. Change that G in the right hand in measure 5 to a quarter note tied to an eighth note. Hell, I'd recommend putting that entire measure in one layer; not only is it silly to extend a note for one sixteenth note, but it's played by a trumpet, so it's definitely not extended in the original, anyways.

-For measure 6, it seems like you're assuming that readers will interpret rhythms of each staff direction as being completely separate, but in reality, this measure looks like a lot of things, but 4/4 isn't one of them Here's how I would write that measure:

It may be slightly misleading in terms of voice leading, but it's the only way I can think of that makes it clear to somebody sight-reading the piece what that rhythm is supposed to be. The problem before was that A: it wasn't clear that the half note G was supposed to be played during, not at the end of, the dotted half note before it, and B: it wasn't clear that the upward-stemmed triplet was supposed to be played during the downward-stemmed half note before it.
How to do this and avoid a bunch of annoying stem flipping stuff: Write the two G half notes in layer one, and the rest in layer two.

-Measures 7 and 8, if you're going to hold the trumpet and horn lines out to full duration in measures 5 and 6 (and I'm glad you did!), you should do it here, too.

-Measures 9-10, make sure that both the trumpet and the horn are present in the RH. They each have different half notes all the way through both measures.

-Measure 11, you might wanna listen to this again in the original. It remains in the same amount of voices, so I'm kind of confused about the whole notes. Just write the trumpet and horn lines in two layers, you won't have to deal with all that three-layer headache, haha. And make sure that the rhythms in beats 1 and 2 (RH) are the same as one another; you may want to rethink both the rhythm and the pitches for that triplet.

-As bespinben said, definitely fill out the harmonies where you're emulating the strings. It may also illuminate the harmony discrepancy with the timpani that I mentioned earlier.

-Back to the timpani line:
This may be complicated to implement with your percussion imitation (which, by the way, I really like the way you did it, aside from the harmonies). But, the motion of the timpani is initially an upward one. This may seem insignificant, seeing as octave displacement is pretty easy for most listeners to do, but doing it with the bassline is essentially inverting the chord. This may be a modal piece, so it isn't bound entirely to classic tonality, but it's still a very stark difference from the original to have the "tonic" chord in second inversion (fifth is in the bass). It weakens the strength of the constant low "C", which in turn weakens the strength of the Dorian mode. This is slightly offset by the fact that it's articulated on a weak beat, but it's still kind of problematic. Try doing it as an upward motion, and see what you can do to incorporate the snare imitation on top of that.

-Try adding some articulation. I won't say where (partly out of apathy), but there are some things that could really use staccato markings.

-Just realized, that second timpani note should be a dotted quarter tied to a half note, not the other way around. Remember, unless it's one of those situations I mentioned, make sure that the center of the measure is clearly shown.

-Try changing the ostinato a bit for measure 17-18, because in the original, it's definitely a different feel from the rest of the piece.

-This is going to be the most subjective suggestion I make in this entire post: If you want a note that doesn't change from harmony to harmony, C is the only one that works, and this would strengthen the pitch center.

Overall, despite my thorough nitpickiness (even when I said I wouldn't be that specific; at least I left pitch-specifics for you to figure out ), this is a pretty good first arrangement. It's especially hard because you went with incorporating percussion that is essentially pitchless; it was a very good move, but very hard to pull off (and you're very close! Just fit it within the harmonies ).

[mikey]

Oh boy xD  I'll look through this when I have time and no company, my changes should all be done Sunday/Monday
And thank you!

[mikey]

PROGRESS

-Please, please use "L" to flip your note stems. Measures 11 and 12 are illegible.fixed
-In more than a few places, your layers overlap, and badly. Rests should not be on top of notes.fixed
-I feel that the short crescendo is unnecessary.fixed lol
-Yes, notepad can do text formatting. Please review this.lower priority, but getting to it
-Maybe ask someone with finale to add some 8vb markings.done
-It sounds pretty accurate.hopefully a bit more now

Nocturne's first arrangement! Not bad. Not bad.

I don't want to rob you of the joy of self-evaluation, so instead of overhauling this myself (as has been my manner with some), I'm going to give you some pointers:

1.) Listen through the original song very carefully, and write in those harmonies you missed. They really bring a lot to the OOMPH of the C dorian (that's right it's not minor!). Some specific places include measures 1-4 (the long string tones), m. 12 (the sycopated trumpet line), m. 17-18 (string backings behind the melody), and elsewhere.almost fixed

2.) This is a quick fix. Clean up the LH ostinato a bit. There are places where the Eb in the upper layer of it don't gel with the voices in the RH, and when it does fit in the harmonic framework, it's still texturally very gritty (not a good thing). It's an interpretation of the percussion after all, so IMO I'd say just omit the Eb entirely.meshes better

3.) Kinda along the same vein as maelstrom, the organization of the layers needs attention. I'm pretty sure Notepad will let you flip stems with L. There are a few places where you could easily clean up the cluttered feel by combining everything into one layer (ex: measure 5).fixed

Below, Fierce says not to be too specific and writes a dissertation:

(I'll also try not to be too specific, because as bespinben said, self-evaluation is great, and super important for improving as an arranger! But I'll mostly just be omitting pitch-specific instructions, because there are certain things I can see being hard to figure out without being told. The pitches, I'm sure you can hear if you know where to listen for it.)

On the Eb in the ostinato: Ehhhhh. I had to listen to the original to be sure, but yeah, that's very harmonically misleading. It's strange to include a pedal note where there wasn't originally one, let alone a whole triad (well, the dyad is really what isn't there). It'd be one thing if what you're emulating had a distinct, yet not specifically tuned pitch (such as a tom tom), but when emulating snare, it's best not to interfere with the harmony at all. It's not just the Eb that I'd change, to be honest; it may not be apparent from what you've notated, but that G is clashing even more with the harmony than the Eb is (the Eb could be written off as a seventh; the G is a ninth, in the original harmony!) Definitely reconsider that percussion interpretation to go along with the actual harmony. The harmony will be much clearer once you fix the second note in the timpani line; it changes to a different note every two measures up until measure 17 (and in the measures where it would be different, it's especially important, because it's the root of the chord).partly fixed, still having trouble hearing a change lol

Some more specific things:

-This one's actually a pretty glaring issue for not having been pointed out yet; you're missing an entire measure before it repeats back to measure 5.fixed

-As far as layers and stem direction go, while 11 and 12 are super messy, it's at least kinda clear what's meant. Measures 5 and 6, however, are in need of a little more help. While the rules of tying notes versus using the full value can get pretty messy, here's a general guideline to go by: only cross a note over the center of a measure if it both starts on and ends on a beat. This means that half notes started on beat 2, as well as dotted half notes started on beat 1 or 2, are fine. However, a dotted quarter note initiated on beat 2 is pretty nonstandard, and especially confusing to read with all of this layering going on. Change that G in the right hand in measure 5 to a quarter note tied to an eighth note. Hell, I'd recommend putting that entire measure in one layer; not only is it silly to extend a note for one sixteenth note, but it's played by a trumpet, so it's definitely not extended in the original, anyways.currently fixing

-For measure 6, it seems like you're assuming that readers will interpret rhythms of each staff direction as being completely separate, but in reality, this measure looks like a lot of things, but 4/4 isn't one of them Here's how I would write that measure:

It may be slightly misleading in terms of voice leading, but it's the only way I can think of that makes it clear to somebody sight-reading the piece what that rhythm is supposed to be. The problem before was that A: it wasn't clear that the half note G was supposed to be played during, not at the end of, the dotted half note before it, and B: it wasn't clear that the upward-stemmed triplet was supposed to be played during the downward-stemmed half note before it.fixed
How to do this and avoid a bunch of annoying stem flipping stuff: Write the two G half notes in layer one, and the rest in layer two.

-Measures 7 and 8, if you're going to hold the trumpet and horn lines out to full duration in measures 5 and 6 (and I'm glad you did!), you should do it here, too.also working on this

-Measures 9-10, make sure that both the trumpet and the horn are present in the RH. They each have different half notes all the way through both measures.fixed

-Measure 11, you might wanna listen to this again in the original. It remains in the same amount of voices, so I'm kind of confused about the whole notes. Just write the trumpet and horn lines in two layers, you won't have to deal with all that three-layer headache, haha. And make sure that the rhythms in beats 1 and 2 (RH) are the same as one another; you may want to rethink both the rhythm and the pitches for that triplet.not fixed, might need more clarification

-As bespinben said, definitely fill out the harmonies where you're emulating the strings. It may also illuminate the harmony discrepancy with the timpani that I mentioned earlier.fixed

-Back to the timpani line:
This may be complicated to implement with your percussion imitation (which, by the way, I really like the way you did it, aside from the harmonies). But, the motion of the timpani is initially an upward one. This may seem insignificant, seeing as octave displacement is pretty easy for most listeners to do, but doing it with the bassline is essentially inverting the chord. This may be a modal piece, so it isn't bound entirely to classic tonality, but it's still a very stark difference from the original to have the "tonic" chord in second inversion (fifth is in the bass). It weakens the strength of the constant low "C", which in turn weakens the strength of the Dorian mode. This is slightly offset by the fact that it's articulated on a weak beat, but it's still kind of problematic. Try doing it as an upward motion, and see what you can do to incorporate the snare imitation on top of that.I'm not sure if it's upward or not but I'll get to it after finishing other stuff

-Try adding some articulation. I won't say where (partly out of apathy), but there are some things that could really use staccato markings.it's very attached and legato and tenuto-y, but I'll try

-Just realized, that second timpani note should be a dotted quarter tied to a half note, not the other way around. Remember, unless it's one of those situations I mentioned, make sure that the center of the measure is clearly shown.working

-Try changing the ostinato a bit for measure 17-18, because in the original, it's definitely a different feel from the rest of the piece.have yet to get to this

-This is going to be the most subjective suggestion I make in this entire post: If you want a note that doesn't change from harmony to harmony, C is the only one that works, and this would strengthen the pitch center.trying it

Overall, despite my thorough nitpickiness (even when I said I wouldn't be that specific; at least I left pitch-specifics for you to figure out ), this is a pretty good first arrangement. It's especially hard because you went with incorporating percussion that is essentially pitchless; it was a very good move, but very hard to pull off (and you're very close! Just fit it within the harmonies ).I mean technically all percussive instruments have a pitch it's just their specific timbre that makes it seem pitchless   but thank you!

Just a quick update to show how far I currently am, I'll upload my changes after finishing all the fixes!

[mikey]

Dropbox works now so I have one; the problem is the Midi and MUS still have 1 bar of rests that I can't seem to delete no matter what I do.  Any other advice would be appreciated!

[Maelstrom]

Select the bars (Both treble and bass) and push Ctrl X

[mikey]

It won't let me select them is the problem
I've deleted them before but somehow they came back >.> with a VENGEANCE

[Xaoz]

Hey,

maybe it is just me, but the midi file is not working (mus is alright, though).

[mikey]

you're right, my bad.  I'll try to get a working one up sometime today