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Messages - PlayfulPiano

#76
Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 21, 2021, 05:37:46 AMYeah sorry I was def thinking when I wrote this that there must've been some thought behind the accompaniment to be what it was.  I can understand your reasoning.

Anywhere there is that repeated m1-8 section I would make those notes consistent with each other, but if you wanted to keep this more of an arranged version of the song you could keep the note lengths as you have them.  As I listen to them again, I think it would be fine to at least take off the staccatos.  Maybe look at measures like m69-71 where the LH and RH are currently overlapping in a way that's going to be tough to do as written

I kept the staccatos, I actually liked them since it helps keep the syncopation with the left clearer.

Also I did some fixes in the left hand that I didn't notice due to copying (as well as some mistaken barring).

Updated.

Edit 2021/09/23: Did some other extra note adjustments after looking through the track again. Mainly in regards to m29-m44, + some dynamics / crescendo additions. Also fixed a few missing ties in m25-26, and added some notable articulations.

Updated again.
#77
Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PMNice job on putting this together so soon after release.  Never played Deltarune or Undertale (it sits in my Steam library two years after purchase lol), but have enjoyed the music very much of both games.

Here's some aesthetic comments:

-I would fix the current page spacing on the first page.  There's a lot of space at the bottom, and I think the other systems wouldn't hurt to have some additional space to compensate
Added some more spacing between systems for page one.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PM-m37's system is very close.  Increase the distance between staffs here
Fixed up spacing, also made it more even.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PM-m45-50 are very tight. As a matter of fact the rhythms seem like they'd line up fine if they were 3 systems of two measures here instead of the current selection.  I'd offer the same point for 13-24, and  m61-66.  Maybe this is subjective on my part, but maybe one more page of this won't hurt at all between these and the aforementioned distances.
I wouldn't have mind making it less measures per system, but as it stands right now the actual phrasing within the arrangement fits really well between pages (phrase 1 being the first 8 systems, transition phrase on the last system of page 2 and the first system of page 3, phrase 2 being the 2nd-5th systems on page 3, phrase 4 being the entirety of page 4 and the first two phrases of page 5, and then phrase 5 being the remainder of page 5 and the rest of page 6), besides it perfectly ending on a full page 6.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PM-Move the dynamics in m1, m37, m60, m61 and the RH's mp in m77 just a bit to the right more so they're centered.
-Move the "Loops from Beginning." text higher
Done with all of this. I made the dynamics position "center on primary notehead" so it should probably work fine like that.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PMAnd as for actual Notes:
-m9 LH I hear this as the accompaniment/bass notes.  This is essentially what most of the LH would be doing for a huge chunk of the song, with some variation.
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I do believe what you wrote is accurate (based on what I've seen from other people's arrangements or covers of the track), but in a solo piano context I don't think a direct 1:1 transcription would fit best here. It would sound too muddy with it being basically constant 16ths within a small note range. Plus there are parts later on in the track that I *really* enjoy with the accompaniment I currently have written (e.g. the final few measures when it's transposed upwards to Eb minor and has the correctly repeating rhythm with the Eb4/Bb3).

Not sure how this take will be viewed for like, updaters / NSM policy, but I hope this is fine long term for the arrangement even if it isn't fully accurate.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PM-Furthermore, this is m9 melody part; I didn't include every pitch I heard for the 16th note part (the lower notes), and I might be missing a pitch on 1.5 and 1.25.
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I have those notes included in what I written, but I wrote them with chromatic seconds due to the more (bloated? muted? muddy?) tone of the saxophone.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PM-m53-m55 and m57-m59 I hear the first two notes of all of these measures as Fb and Db for beat 1, and Eb and Cn for beat 2.
Good catch, fixed this.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PM-The following is what I heard at m56; apologies if I have some incorrect harmonic spellings
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Added the secondary layer to the right hand. Thanks for this (I made the Cb a Bn for reference, not sure which is the right harmonic spelling either lmao).

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PMThis LH portion needs a bit of a revisit, in addition to what I outlined for m56.  I do not hear the rhythm that was submitted, especially that second layer.  See my second photo below for a simplification idea I had for m56 so that the LH is a bit more manageable for this section.
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Oh no like I know the second lower layer is probably not the greatest for that section (I basically just wrote some random thing that sounded alright ish), but I did keep the doubling up of the melody an octave down since it's two instruments playing the notes at the same time. When I mentioned the accompaniment I mainly was referring to the second layer, not the doubled melody.
I just don't know what accompaniment to write while keeping the doubled melody in the left hand. I was thinking of something related to dotted eighths, hence what I wrote there.

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PM-The melody notes in m1-m8 RH are a little too long by at least a sixteenth note-  I don't hear these as tied or dotted eighth's but rather as staccato eighth's or sixteenth's depending on how the beaming falls
I can make them staccato eighths for sure. Just m1-m8 or any point which has this sort of right hand phrasing? (i.e. m17-m24, m61-m76, did not change these for reference)

Quote from: Kricketune54 on September 20, 2021, 06:06:58 PMI think Big Shot needs some additional attention.  The LH part is very different from the actual song audio from m9 onwards, and the RH melody lines are often held way too long or not correct... I am not hearing a lot of the neighbor notes currently present that are making it sound a bit too dissonant.  I can give some further feedback regarding specific notes if there is some clarification needed because I didn't cover a whole lot notewise.

I'd focus first on fixing up the accompaniment parts given it's a fairly easy bassline to hear, and then circle back on the melody lines beyond what I commented about
I hope with my comments I might give a better idea on why I made some of the decisions I made with the bassline / that it's ok to keep as is.

Thanks for giving feedback though. Updated.
#78

NOW'S YOUR CHANCE TO BE A [[BIG SHOT]].

So uh I guess I'm planting my flag on being the first person to submit a Chapter 2 track. And it's BIG SHOT. And the chromatics.
Oh god the chromatics.

Ok, overall, I'm SUPER happy with how I did *most* of this arrangement so far. My main personal concerns come in:
-m29-m36 feeling possibly a bit empty
-m48-m52 if I got the chromatics right
-m53-m59 in regards to the accompaniment for the left hand
-m77-m78 in regards to the senza pedal position & the "Looping" text (for reference: the actual audio/midi does not repeat, I have the repeat set to only 1x play not 2x).

So yeah. Cool.
#79
Quote from: Bloop on September 17, 2021, 10:21:33 AMNice! The sheet is all good now! There's something strange with the midi, however. In the second part with the arpeggio's (from 3:51 on), the dynamics don't seem to restart after two bars, so everything is very quiet very quickly (at least, that's how it sounds in windows media player). After some studying, it's probably because of the hidden dynamics: the end-dynamics are placed at the very end of the bar and all hidden descrendos start at the very start and end at the very end. I believe those override the dynamic marking at the start at the bar, which means the piece only gets quieter and quieter. I took the liberty to move all of those in by a bit, and it seems to have worked. There may still be some variance in if the decresendo works properly or not, but at least everything is hearable. I can update the file for you, but I just wanted to be sure if you're okay with it too:
[MID]
Yeah that's fine Bloop.
#80
Quote from: Bloop on September 16, 2021, 12:24:28 PMThe shift is actually just a sixteenth note, which is a bit more manageable, so no worries about that. The ties look pretty good mostly! Only in 81, 83, 113 and 115 they look a bit too horizontal. I'd suggest moving down the beams from the cross-staved arpeggio's, so the tie's can in turn be moved down a bit too. Also, in m.101 and 102, the staccato is missing on the eighth note.
I mean nearly every track in nearly every OST has a fadeout at the end, because nearly every track repeats in-game. I doubt there are many arrangements with fadeouts though. I also wonder if people are that adamant to play the track until the very end of the fadeout, no earlier or later.
If you put repeat signs between m.117 and 132, and put "Fine" or something descriptive like "end of OST" at 126, you can have the clarity of where the repeat is as well as knowing where the piece stops (and it saves a page of ink :p). I could also settle with something like a double barline after m.132 and "Fadeout" at 133 (or 137). It's mostly just to make it clear how the different sections of the piece interact.
-yeah mb i meant 16th not 32nd.
Fixed the ties and staccatos
-I added "OST ends here on second repeat." at the end of m126 (it acts as a second pass Fine), and I removed the 11th page by adding in a repeat like you said. Hope this looks fine.

Updated.
#81
Quote from: Bloop on September 16, 2021, 10:35:22 AMNice work! Here's some of my comments:

-m.49-67 R.H.: The voice in the second layer here should actually play the melody in the first layer but an octave lower, right? You don't really need it as harmonic filling, as most of the pitches would be doubled in the melody or in the arpeggio's anyway, so you could just double the melody an octave below.
-m.69-84 and 101-end: Maybe having the last note of these arpeggios as a staccato 8th note (instead of a 32nd note with those rests following) makes a bit more sense here. It removes the 32nd and 16th rests, as those may cause some confusion with counting rests. Also, maybe it's worth nudging some of the ties and beams up or down so they don't collide with each other. It's not really a readability problem, but it justs look a bit nicer. Compare:
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instead of
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-I'm not familiar with the game, but does the song fade out in the original as well or does it just repeat sections? I'm mainly asking because of the end of the arrangement: currently, you have arranged the fade out with a diminuendo marking, but that doesn't really work well as an ending, as you can't really play a fade out on piano reliably. I usually prefer either just putting a repeat mark back to where the song repeats to, or creating your own alternatine ending. This would be something like an alternate ending at m.133:
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You don't have to use this specific ending of course, it's just to give you an idea of how to end the piece without a fade out.
-Not exactly. The right hand is basically structured into 3 different layers: the melody, the ostinato, and the accompaniment (vocals? strings?). *Technically* the vocals written as they are right now are not 100% accurate to the original (e.g. m53 should have Eb4/Eb5 and not a tied D4 with an Eb5), as I felt that the right hand flow didn't fit as well with the notes in question / the octaves were too up front when the original had the lower notes quieter due to the instrument choice. Therefore I instead repeated the (vocals? strings?) pattern from previous phrases (D --> D --> D --> C --> C --> Bb --> Ab/C --> Bb/D or G/B), but replacing the last two with an octave Ab4 and F4 to match the vocals due to them being louder in the playback & fitting with the hand positioning.

-This is a smart change for the measure ranges you specified. I was mainly worried b/c there is the middle section you didn't include which has that small 32nd rest shift in beats for the arpeggio.
I'll try to adjust ties the best I can.

-On an in game context, the track here is of a repeated phrase that has two versions depending on what section of the level you're in. Note how the first half and second half completely overlap in this phrasing, since in game once you go from section one to section two, the music will morph into the other section. Now this does repeat in game yes, but in the OST it *is* a fadeout written as such (ending at the same length of time, 7:27). So it's hard to setup a good loop for this.
I personally prefer keeping the fadeout over making a custom ending, both to keep its accuracy to the original OST track, and to allow performers to be able to sync their performances over the original track if they so choose.

Updated.
#82
Quote from: Static on September 12, 2021, 09:39:13 AMThis looks really clean and readable, so I'm gonna get right into the finer details here:

- With regards to the page count and spacing, obviously it'd be nice to have less pages, but I think it's a bit more important to have your music look readable and clear - even if that means adding some pages. With that said, if you use a mixture of 3- and 2-measure systems, you can perfectly fit this on 9 pages without it looking too cramped. Up to you though.
- m13/45/81/113: All the other parts you included for the other measures happen to have all the notes of each respective chord. But m13/etc. is Fm9, the most important note of which is Ab (the minor 3rd). As it is now, the chord sounds tonally ambiguous, it could be major or minor. I would suggest moving the lower RH voice from C to Ab to remedy this.
- That natural sign in m32/36 LH is pretty close to the barline, but it should fix itself if you just click on the note.
- You can move the mp in m33 down, it's a bit close to the tie.
- "Grace Notes Second Time Only" doesn't need to have every word capitalized, only "Grace" needs to be (or just leave it all lowercase).
- The F in the melody in m53 sounds like it's restruck quickly. You can indicate this with an unslurred grace note:

- m63-64 RH: To better show the resolution from Bbsus4 to Bb, I would make the whole note in Layer 2 of m63 Eb instead of F
- m117-124, 133-140: Those RH whole notes sound more like G's all the way through
- m129: This RH whole note sounds like F instead of Eb
- For the 32nd note section, when you have those big ties, I would generally try to avoid having them go through the beams if you can. They kinda get lost in there and it looks a bit messy. Ideally they should just cut through the stems of the 32nd notes.
- Generally, there's a fair amount more space at the bottom of each page compared to the top. That 3rd Layer half note in m60 for example is really close to the text above it. I would increase the top margin of each of the top systems to around 0.35.
- Instead of pppp or ppp, n (niente, literally "nothing" dynamic) might be more appropriate. Niente isn't a default dynamic, so you have to go to the Expression Selection menu > Dynamics > Create Dynamic... > Set font as Maestro > go to Text (at the very top of the box) > Inserts > Symbol... > scroll to #150 (n) > click OK. Playback doesn't automatically work for these, so just hide the pppp dynamics.

I might do page spacing after the other changes just to make sure it doesn't look crowded in post.

Instead of replacing it, I decided to add the Ab as a third (nice catching that btw I didn't even notice it was two notes). Also I added a G to the B in the following measures because I'm pretty sure that not only sounds better but is also more accurate. Same with a Bb to the Bbmaj chord variant.

Fixed the naturals.

Fixed the mp.

Fixed the grace note mention.

Interesting, but I can't really seem to hear this personally at the measure you specified. Instead I think I hear what you're talking about in b3 of m58 instead.

The F is accurate as I'm trying to base the notes on the strings rather than the chord itself, + that's where the piano ostinato comes into play anyways for the Eb.

My god you're right about that G. Great catch. Actually, I think the lower G/Eb pattern plays throughout the track anyways, but the upper part of this middle section stops in the final few measures.

You're hearing the high F5 in m130. Basically these strings technically fade in a measure earlier but I have it written so they're played at the point when they have a more notable volume. I'm fairly sure the lower note is an Eb4.

I was told that ties through beams are fine as long as they go through and not into like noteheads / stems.

I tried doing that but it led to some systems being moved around which I wanna try and avoid. Maybe i'll get into that if I do partial 3 measure systems idk.

Is using niente fine as an audio cue which isn't related to a track fadeout? If so I'll definitely change it if you confirm.


Submission is otherwise updated with the changes mentioned.

#83
Quote from: Static on September 08, 2021, 04:18:59 PMDo you mean still having 4 measures per system? With 16th notes, it looks very cramped. You could achieve the same results in the current sheet by having 8 measures per system.
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The OST stuff makes much more sense now, thanks. Let's just keep it as "Minecraft".
oh yeah actually yeah you're right, I double checked my incomplete arrangement and I had it at two measures per system, not four.

still kinda feel like 2 per with sixteenths looks cleaner but that might just be me.
#84
Quote from: Static on September 08, 2021, 03:47:23 PMPersonally, I think counting this at 84bpm (as opposed to 42...) makes a lot more sense. It's more easy to feel the pulse that way, and 82 is still a pretty slow-moderate tempo. It's a slow piece, but not that slow.
Would it not be unreasonable for the tempo to be eighth = 84, keeping the same 84 beat pulse but done with a less lengthy measure extension? Would decrease the page # too, no?

Quote from: Static on September 08, 2021, 03:47:23 PM- As someone not that familiar with Minecraft, this track appears to be from a different version of the game. Are we just going to keep the on-site title the same, à la Celeste? If so, maybe change the title in the sheet itself. Or just go with whatever makes sense to you Minecraft people. I'll just assume this is fine as-is for now.
Track is part of the base game and is not a unique version. Rather it's an OST specific to an update of the game from a different composer vs. the original, but is nonetheless still the base game. Unless we should be naming tracks based on OST titles instead of game titles, in which therefore probably the "Wet Hands" and "Sweden" tracks should have the subtitle renamed to "Minecraft: Volume Alpha". But I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

Quote from: Static on September 08, 2021, 03:47:23 PM- Does this repeat in-game? If so, I'd write that instead of just ending the piece on a fadeout. If it does actually just fadeout in-game, then maybe add an extra ending bar (like a low octave E or something, the video you linked sounds like it does that right at the end). Up to you.
No repeats. Minecraft songs are just like that with fadeouts.
#85

oh wow so this is a doozie ain't it

so this was an arrangement I initially did to completion back when I was using musescore in like... 2018.

finally was able to redo the entire arrangement from scratch in finale, using some of the newer tools I didn't have easy access to before (crossstaff, hidden dynamics, etc.), as well as making some corrections I discovered while listening to it again (had to rewrite some measures due to some missing notes, haha).

The main issue of the arrangement as is would probably be it being 2 measures per system after measure m68, but as it stands right now the arrangement DOES perfectly fill out the last page (page 11). So it might be fine to keep the 2 measure system as is, even if it's gonna be 11 pages (and to be honest, if it was changed to like 3 measures per system it might only reduce it by a page or two).

Oh and I'm a slight bit unsure with what the pitch is for the held note in the left hand of m123 and m139 (it's I think one of An, G, or Bb?).

so yeah, hope you enjoy.

Edit: oh yeah and there's a weird thing with the repeat section. if I try expanding the line it changes color & I don't think it aligns correctly, not sure why.
#86
Site News / Re: Update, Tuesday 31st of August 2021
August 30, 2021, 07:19:29 PM
Quote from: BlueKirby on August 30, 2021, 07:14:48 PM>finally another minecraft sheet up

YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

>star allies too

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
we do be slackin in mc music
#87
..........dammit I should've stopped putting off my arrangement lmao

-Don't use the extended lines for pedal markings. Instead replace it with a simple "con pedale" expression box beneath the bass clef.
-You can arguably rewrite the track at half the written time, i.e. making every 2 measure phrase condensed into one measure by halving the duration of every note (8th notes --> 16th notes, quarter notes --> 8th notes, etc.).
-You should probably cross the ostinato between both staves throughout the track, especially since once you get to m41 it's pretty clear that the ostinato should be played only by the left hand more or less.
-Octaves that start at m9 vary from being at the level you have written there & a level an octave lower outright. Just grabbing out of my unfinished rubedo arrangement, here's what I basically did for reference:

-m53+ in regards to the left hand high note accompinament melody, you should realistically rethink how you want to do this. Rule of thumb is to avoid any intervals for one hand over a 10th, and even that should be avoidable whenever possible. My suggestion would be to make the left hand's octave based on the melody with the middle note being the E. So like for example in m53 instead of a E2/E3/G3 chord, you have a G2/E3/G3 chord. And for walk downs like m54 b3, you can do F2/E3/F3.
-m73 should start with a very notable crescendo up until the climax. Maybe also accent the left hand chords. And this section as a whole I think should be a lot more heavy with the octaves involved in both the left and right hand.
#88
Quote from: Latios212 on August 28, 2021, 07:09:48 PMThis is a wonderful sheet - great job Playful for writing it out and many thanks to MSF, Zeila, and others on Discord for the feedback and help polishing it up. The notes look right and I agree with all of the voicing/articulation decisions made.

I only have some minor visual feedback before we call this one done :P
- Fix the page 2 margins to match page 1. Moving the header within the 0.5" top margin also means less vertical space on page 2 - you may be able to move the top/bottom staff slightly closer together (maybe to a distance of around 1.05"-1.1") in the first and second systems while making sure the dynamics are centered between staves
- Move the left end of the crescendo in the beginning right a bit so it's not so close to the ppp (similar in 23)
- Staccato missing in m. 24 beat 3 top layer
- The dim. in the last system is too close to the stems in m. 35-36. A couple of ways you could deal with this are to increase the LH/RH staff gap or use a text "dim." instead. But what I would suggest is starting the hairpin diminuendo later. It doesn't sound to me in the original that it starts until roughly the middle of measure 36.
fixed and updated
#89
Quote from: mastersuperfan on August 27, 2021, 05:29:31 PMokay one more thing now again lol, since you moved the crescendo up, move the n at the end up too so they're aligned
bruh

fixed
#90
Quote from: mastersuperfan on August 27, 2021, 05:05:56 PMLooks good, I'll approve. Although one more thing, the crescendo is colliding with the stem in m35.

fixed