NinSheetMusic Forums

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- Physical stuff, like posture, fingering, techniques etc.
- Also includes the mental side of things, like handling recording anxiety, handling boredom in practice, quick-study methods, all of that
- Emotional things, I guess: if you're going to quit, or if practice is driving you nuts, or...you get. xD


Or, if you're stuck with a particular passage in a particular sheet, feel free to quote it here! If you're lucky, the original arranger might give you a helping hand~

Also, none of us are professionals here, I believe - you will not be getting advice from experts/specialists in the piano, but you should be able to gather enough opinions and ideas to formulate your own approach. I like to think I'm quite experienced on the instrument, especially when it comes to learning easy-to-moderate-level pieces with maximum speed and minimum effort. Doesn't make me a pro, but I could help clear up the fog ahead of you just a little ^^

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Also, this is not just my thread haha - you can respond to any question if you think it contributes positively to the asker. As long as you have some advice to share and there are topic/questions that need to be answered, feel free to chip in! :) The more opinions there are, the better the learning process.

That said, try to stay civil I suppose. Criticism can get ugly xD

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On my end, along with answering the questions you guys have, from time to time, I'll try to do live demonstration videos to answer certain queries. ^^ Here's an example, for a guy who asked about playing the "National Park" cadenza on my channel:

Spoiler

[close]

Hope this helps everyone somehow, and ask away! :)

I'm gonna use this so much o.o

So first dumb question! If there is a note with a sharp but no key for that note (i.e. The treble E note right here:   (https://i.imgur.com/tc9c7Pl_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=high)) do you always jump up to the exact next key, F in this case?

Thanks!

Yes, that's correct. E# is the same as F. It's just written like that for certain situations. Similarly, Cb is B. After that there's double sharps and double flats but those probably won't be necessary right now lol. Have fun.

Quote from: swimswamit on August 12, 2017, 04:39:59 AMSo first dumb question! If there is a note with a sharp but no key for that note (i.e. The treble E note right here:   (https://i.imgur.com/tc9c7Pl_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=high)) do you always jump up to the exact next key, F in this case?

Mmhmm! Exactly what Waluigi said :)

As a side note, if you'd like to understand the rationale behind this, and for anyone interested in the harmony stuff behind the scenes: E# exists because it wants to resolve (i.e. melodically progress) to F#. Similarly, Cb exists because it wants to resolve down to Bb. These seemingly extrarreneous sharps/flats and the whole double-sharp/flat thing - these show melodic resolving tendencies. So if you see an E# on the score you can almost certainly expect an F# right after it, possibly decorated with notes in between ^^

Quote from: WaluigiTime64 on August 12, 2017, 04:54:05 AMYes, that's correct. E# is the same as F. It's just written like that for certain situations. Similarly, Cb is B. After that there's double sharps and double flats but those probably won't be necessary right now lol. Have fun.

thanks! That has confused me for a while. That's over my head daj, but I think I understand.

So for your arrangement of national park, I've gotten the ascending portion of the cadenza down comfortably, but I can't figure out fingerings for the descending portion straight after.
Halp?

Now this is a topic that I like. Maybe we could get this pinned in the help topic?

Quote from: Sebastian on August 12, 2017, 09:01:02 AMNow this is a topic that I like. Maybe we could get this pinned in the help topic?

ahh seb i love you haha you know i do ^^

~

Quote from: braixen1264 on August 12, 2017, 06:04:27 AMSo for your arrangement of national park, I've gotten the ascending portion of the cadenza down comfortably, but I can't figure out fingerings for the descending portion straight after.
Halp?

First of all, thank you for learning my National Park haha, I hope it'll be a meaningful enough journey learning that sheet xD

As for the descending part of the cadenza - the fingerings I used are 3-2-| 1-2-3, where the line denotes a split between the right hand and the left hand. The whole flourish downwards is played on one pedal. You're not expected to play that passage with full legato on one hand...that's just evil. :p Hopefully you weren't trying to do that.

In general, for these cadenzas, as long as you can find a fingering that is comfortable and can sound convincing (when played confidently and with pedal)...you've nailed it. Cadenzas are where, in the moment of performance, you use the maximum amount of cheating power you've got to make an impression even if you don't know what the fuck is going on, so to achieve this condition you need to be comfortable ^^

If you'd like, I can dig out my old sheets of National Park and scan them for your reference! :) And hope this helped a little~

Quote from: daj on August 12, 2017, 09:35:05 AMIf you'd like, I can dig out my old sheets of National Park and scan them for your reference! :) And hope this helped a little~

That would be amazing :o

Quote from: braixen1264 on August 12, 2017, 07:44:43 PMThat would be amazing :o

REJECTED. (http://tinyurl.com/dajquiet5scan)

(also excuse the general messiness ahaha, i did spend quite a bit of myself learning this one xD)

Anyone have a recommendation for a sheet I could learn that's good for a new pianist but will help me progress some? I've kind of in a rut right now. I've been trying mimiga town but I can't get the left hand yet for the 2nd part and would like something to try on the side.

Am a Pokemon and zelda fan (only really enjoy the older zelda music wind waker and before), super mario galaxy is great too but I think all of those are probably too hard.

>suggests songs for easy playlist
>forgets about it
I'll just use one of those!

Quote from: swimswamit on August 13, 2017, 06:06:21 AMAnyone have a recommendation for a sheet I could learn that's good for a new pianist but will help me progress some? I've kind of in a rut right now. I've been trying mimiga town but I can't get the left hand yet for the 2nd part and would like something to try on the side.

Am a Pokemon and zelda fan (only really enjoy the older zelda music wind waker and before), super mario galaxy is great too but I think all of those are probably too hard.

Honestly, when I checked up the sheet for "Mimiga Town", I laughed a bit. It's one of those sheets I'll look at and instantly give up. xD Too much counting, and it's not exactly feel-able.

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If you're a Pokemon and Zelda fan, here's some stuff I've got, and if you'd like to keep it as un-intricate as possible:

"Song of Healing" from Majora's Mask
Definitely. It's got a beautiful melody, and you don't even need to pedal to make it sound good. As long as you enjoy the melody and can count 3/4, I think you can nail this sheet and enjoy it :)

"Story" from Minish Cap
Another beautiful tune, and the left hand part will be tough at first, but the "bass note + chord" figuration is quite common in piano works, so it's very useful to work early. ^^ Plus, you can take your time and this will still sound amazing.

Any Ocarina Tune from OoT :p
They're all quite nice to play! Plus, you could perform then in a series, which is cool :)

"Pokemon League" from Pokemon DPPt
I think this is an amazing sheet to pick up once you've mastered a few previous ones. It's technically quite simple, but musically challenging. If it's tough, cut notes from the chords and cut grace notes - it'll still sound quite okay. And hey, you probably know this tune <3

"An Unwavering Heart" from Pokemon BW
It's quite challenging musically, and you need to plan the way you play the middle voices a bit, but it is absolutely beautiful once you nail it. Taught me a bunch of techniques like double chord spreads and "ghosting" notes, so it's really got a fair bit of musical depth. Notes are not that straightforward but fun to learn - probably won't hurt to cut the middle voice in the second section too ^^

"Title Screen" from OoT
Deku's arrangement is absolutely on-point and super awesome when you get it, but you need to pedal quite well and do some left-hand leaps. It's quite manageable at a slower and freer tempo though :)

Hope that's enough suggestions to get you started! When you say you're a beginner, I'm assuming you mean you've played less than ten or so sheets, so I suggested the sheets that weren't that intricate over the ones that were actually easier to play in terms of hitting the notes. All the best for your learning! ^^

Quote from: daj on August 13, 2017, 06:42:46 AMHonestly, when I checked up the sheet for "Mimiga Town", I laughed a bit. It's one of those sheets I'll look at and instantly give up. xD Too much counting, and it's not exactly feel-able.

~

If you're a Pokemon and Zelda fan, here's some stuff I've got, and if you'd like to keep it as un-intricate as possible:

"Song of Healing" from Majora's Mask
Definitely. It's got a beautiful melody, and you don't even need to pedal to make it sound good. As long as you enjoy the melody and can count 3/4, I think you can nail this sheet and enjoy it :)

"Story" from Minish Cap
Another beautiful tune, and the left hand part will be tough at first, but the "bass note + chord" figuration is quite common in piano works, so it's very useful to work early. ^^ Plus, you can take your time and this will still sound amazing.

Any Ocarina Tune from OoT :p
They're all quite nice to play! Plus, you could perform then in a series, which is cool :)

"Pokemon League" from Pokemon DPPt
I think this is an amazing sheet to pick up once you've mastered a few previous ones. It's technically quite simple, but musically challenging. If it's tough, cut notes from the chords and cut grace notes - it'll still sound quite okay. And hey, you probably know this tune <3

"An Unwavering Heart" from Pokemon BW
It's quite challenging musically, and you need to plan the way you play the middle voices a bit, but it is absolutely beautiful once you nail it. Taught me a bunch of techniques like double chord spreads and "ghosting" notes, so it's really got a fair bit of musical depth. Notes are not that straightforward but fun to learn - probably won't hurt to cut the middle voice in the second section too ^^

"Title Screen" from OoT
Deku's arrangement is absolutely on-point and super awesome when you get it, but you need to pedal quite well and do some left-hand leaps. It's quite manageable at a slower and freer tempo though :)

Hope that's enough suggestions to get you started! When you say you're a beginner, I'm assuming you mean you've played less than ten or so sheets, so I suggested the sheets that weren't that intricate over the ones that were actually easier to play in terms of hitting the notes. All the best for your learning! ^^

haha, I thought I was the only one with that mimiga town sheet. You were right about less than 10 sheets or so, I've only fully completed 5-6, most I can only do half. Thanks for the suggestions, somehow the song of healing completely slipped my mind!

These are some great recommendations, the OOT title screen is probably my favorite song in the game, and i'm interested in hearing minish cap since i've never listened to any of it.
Thanks!
To-do list: get a pedal!

Before I saw your reply I went to the easy list and picked out snowman and kakariko village, so I'll be hitting those too. Will probably have some questions, if not i'll just give a little update or maybe record something just for some feedback (or for fun).

How difficult is Littleroot Town? Just finished kakariko and was thinking of trying it.

Quote from: swimswamit on August 19, 2017, 01:53:34 PMHow difficult is Littleroot Town? Just finished kakariko and was thinking of trying it.

Mm...it's quite tough. I'd suggest holding it off for a while - but if you'd like, I've got a "beginner's" version arrangement of this track somewhere in the cloud, I can share that with you ;)

Technically, there's some pretty challenging figures you need to execute: the toughest of which is the cross-hand jumps which have to be done within an eighth note/quaver. Then, musically, there's lots of subtle details that give the track its essence - the grace notes to chords, middle voice weaving in the second section, huge unpredictable jumps in the left hand...stuff I wouldn't consider within the reach of people who'd just started out like yourself ^^;

It is really humbling, though, to hear that you're interested in trying this sheet of mine out. Thanks for that, hehe ^^

Wow, that sounds much worse than I expected o.o, I guess I'll go with the song of healing next then. Thanks daj!

Okie, so this will be a classical (post-romantic actually) question. I know daj doesn't like Rach, but, anyway:

http://imgur.com/a/xa3qo

(étude-tableau op.39 no.7)

This part is perhaps the easiest part of the entire piece, which... ain't fun. But, this part gives me trouble in particular because of the awkward chords. Any alternate fingerings would be appreciated, since the ones I've found mean I can't hold the tied notes or do the legato properly.

Quote from: InsigTurtle on August 20, 2017, 09:22:19 PMOkie, so this will be a classical (post-romantic actually) question. I know daj doesn't like Rach, but, anyway:

Hehe, I'm happy you brought it up on this thread Insig! ^^ While it is true that I don't really like Rach (guys, bigger might not mean better), and i haven't played this piece, from the Rach stuff I've done and studied I think I can give a decent answer :)

I don't think I'll ever even dare to attempt this etude though, and honestly on the high-level classical side I'm not that amazing - so do take this as a suggestion and nothing more :p

QuoteThis part is perhaps the easiest part of the entire piece, which... ain't fun. But, this part gives me trouble in particular because of the awkward chords. Any alternate fingerings would be appreciated, since the ones I've found mean I can't hold the tied notes or do the legato properly.

I thought about it for a bit, and here's what I have:
RH: 2/5 - 1/3 - 1/2/3/5, tied 3
LH: 5/1 - 2 - 5/3/2/1, tied 2

Rach probably didn't have the reach to hit octaves with 1/3 or 3/5, but he does suggest single-finger turns (i.e. no wristing) to hit weird stretches in some figurations like this one. The G minor prelude is full of those, and it's bloody annoying xD

With this fingering, you can use finger turns for full legato for every note except the bottom note of the right-hand chord across the bar. This is a semitone snap-motion from a white key to a black key, which is quite hard to execute (vertical wrist-flick, pivot on the tied note), but probably easier than the alternatives, especially if you want the legato ^^

As an aside, most of us mortals with normal-or-less sized hands cannot do a finger turn from an octave without some wristing - this is for the left hand part. So the focus should be restoring the hand's position for the full chord as soon as possible, after being left in a weird position from twisting over from 1/5 to 2.

...hope this makes sense, really hope it works. All the best! :)

Hey daj, do you have any recommendations for something from Diamond and Pearl?

there is the dppt pokémon league in his easy piano playist iirc

Oh yes, already played that one though, guess that's probably the only easy one.

Ever tried some of daj's sheets? ;p
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfH-Yiby-dM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q0zfeJsANY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSrl3PJq6W0

Quote from: braixen1264 on August 25, 2017, 11:22:14 PMEver tried some of daj's sheets? ;p
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfH-Yiby-dM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q0zfeJsANY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSrl3PJq6W0

yes, I've seen every one of his. Those are definitely more advanced than I am but I appreciate it.

seen and tried are different things

Quote from: braixen1264 on August 26, 2017, 05:49:55 AMseen and tried are different things

:p you have much more confidence in me than I do, i'll try playing them, route 209 is one of my favorites. Thanks braixen.

Quote from: braixen1264 on August 25, 2017, 11:22:14 PMEver tried some of daj's sheets? ;p
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfH-Yiby-dM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q0zfeJsANY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSrl3PJq6W0

ahaha braix you're the best! <3 and i do like to believe sheets are generally easier to play than they look ;)

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Anyway! If you asked me to suggest my DPPt stuff, I'd more or less suggest these. As you said yourself, they're not easy per se, but they are the most reduced form of those tracks I could think of. Just some extra pointers and technical shortcuts:

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Snowpoint City:
What the sheet hides is that you need to pedal quite well to make the music kinda-work, and there's a bit of challenging inner-voicing. I'd rank this around the top of the most musically challenging of my sheets, actually.

That said, it's not that tough to play the notes at a comfortable tempo. So if you'd like to learn this, it'll be one of those sheets you might revisit after some time, once you've acquired more musical skills ^^

~

Route 209:
This is my personal favourite sheet that I did. Not even going to lie here. And if you're learning this, there's lots of resources ready to help you (sheet music video, live cover with score, an album recording)! ^^

What makes this sheet tough is that there are LOTS of moderate-difficulty technical elements to learn. Left-hand double-voicing, staccato chords, some weird counting shenanigans too. But on the whole, it's not that tough - it'll just take some time to learn. So if you're willing to commit to this, firstly I'll be humbled and love you so much, and secondly I've actually helped a bunch of people through this sheet, so I know how to teach/guide the technical bits quite well - you'll be well-armed with guidance, but you'll need to put in a bit of effort~

~

Canalave City:
Pedalling in this sheet is a little tough, but for the first section, playing the notes shouldn't be too big of a challenge :)

The second section, though, is one of the parts I spent the most time working through when I was recording this track for the album. I like to think that you can feel the rhythms once you count it a few times, but it gets hard to count at times. I suppose you could play the rhythm quite freely and cut the right hand notes to only the top line though - that should make things easier ^^

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If you do a sheet of mine, feel free to ask for technical advice - I've played through all of them, so I think I can help a little more than usual if you're stuck :)

That said! I think DPPt, while it is beautiful and deep as hell, it is also one of the most unfriendly soundtracks for both arrangers and performers. Very few pieces aren't rhythmically complex (thus the League theme stands out beautifully <3), so as a pianist you might find it tough to get easy-ish DPPt arrangements - I've tried my best on my channel ahaha~

I'd like to also suggest some other DPPt arrangements that I've tried! ^^ These are quite tough, but maybe they're in a style that I found tough and you might find easier. On NSM we have:

"Route 201", arr. Latios212
I found it hard to play the notes, but I have tiny hands. If tenths aren't too much of a stretchfor you, this should be okay :)

"Decisive Battle (Pokemon League), arr. Zeila
I'm not sure if this one's on-site yet, but it is bloody fun to play and not too tough if you bring down the tempo a little or cut the octaves to single notes (just hit harder, choose the bass notes xD).

"Spear Pillar", forgot who arranged this xD
In the same vein as Decisive Battle, except it's really quite learnable, pretty fun if you get into the whole destroying-the-world feel.

"Floaroma Town", arr. Dr Pamplemouse
This one kinda pushes it. It's not exactly easy, I suppose, and it has five flats, so unless you're familiar with D-flat major it might be hard to learn. I think it's one of those old sheets too?

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Hope this helps, all the best :)

Quote from: daj on August 26, 2017, 07:36:26 AMahaha braix you're the best! <3 and i do like to believe sheets are generally easier to play than they look ;)

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Anyway! If you asked me to suggest my DPPt stuff, I'd more or less suggest these. As you said yourself, they're not easy per se, but they are the most reduced form of those tracks I could think of. Just some extra pointers and technical shortcuts:

~

Snowpoint City:
What the sheet hides is that you need to pedal quite well to make the music kinda-work, and there's a bit of challenging inner-voicing. I'd rank this around the top of the most musically challenging of my sheets, actually.

That said, it's not that tough to play the notes at a comfortable tempo. So if you'd like to learn this, it'll be one of those sheets you might revisit after some time, once you've acquired more musical skills ^^

~

Route 209:
This is my personal favourite sheet that I did. Not even going to lie here. And if you're learning this, there's lots of resources ready to help you (sheet music video, live cover with score, an album recording)! ^^

What makes this sheet tough is that there are LOTS of moderate-difficulty technical elements to learn. Left-hand double-voicing, staccato chords, some weird counting shenanigans too. But on the whole, it's not that tough - it'll just take some time to learn. So if you're willing to commit to this, firstly I'll be humbled and love you so much, and secondly I've actually helped a bunch of people through this sheet, so I know how to teach/guide the technical bits quite well - you'll be well-armed with guidance, but you'll need to put in a bit of effort~

~

Canalave City:
Pedalling in this sheet is a little tough, but for the first section, playing the notes shouldn't be too big of a challenge :)

The second section, though, is one of the parts I spent the most time working through when I was recording this track for the album. I like to think that you can feel the rhythms once you count it a few times, but it gets hard to count at times. I suppose you could play the rhythm quite freely and cut the right hand notes to only the top line though - that should make things easier ^^

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If you do a sheet of mine, feel free to ask for technical advice - I've played through all of them, so I think I can help a little more than usual if you're stuck :)

That said! I think DPPt, while it is beautiful and deep as hell, it is also one of the most unfriendly soundtracks for both arrangers and performers. Very few pieces aren't rhythmically complex (thus the League theme stands out beautifully <3), so as a pianist you might find it tough to get easy-ish DPPt arrangements - I've tried my best on my channel ahaha~

I'd like to also suggest some other DPPt arrangements that I've tried! ^^ These are quite tough, but maybe they're in a style that I found tough and you might find easier. On NSM we have:

"Route 201", arr. Latios212
I found it hard to play the notes, but I have tiny hands. If tenths aren't too much of a stretchfor you, this should be okay :)

"Decisive Battle (Pokemon League), arr. Zeila
I'm not sure if this one's on-site yet, but it is bloody fun to play and not too tough if you bring down the tempo a little or cut the octaves to single notes (just hit harder, choose the bass notes xD).

"Spear Pillar", forgot who arranged this xD
In the same vein as Decisive Battle, except it's really quite learnable, pretty fun if you get into the whole destroying-the-world feel.

"Floaroma Town", arr. Dr Pamplemouse
This one kinda pushes it. It's not exactly easy, I suppose, and it has five flats, so unless you're familiar with D-flat major it might be hard to learn. I think it's one of those old sheets too?

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Hope this helps, all the best :)

This is exactly what I was looking for, thanks so much daj! I won't ask for recommendations anymore till i've learned all these great ones you've thrown out, this is fantastic.

D&P was a game I really grew up with and it's the entire reason I started piano in the first place and since summer's over i'll be able to start up piano lessons with my teacher again and really start making some progress. I've always liked your sheets but were always intimidated by ithem, but if I sit down and really work at it I think I'll be able to make some good progress on them. Thanks for the long answer, I really appreciate all the help you've been giving!

Please don't go near the on site version of Floaroma Town D: everything is wrong with it

I have a completed sheet of it but it's definitely not easy to read and play

I think a lot of things you might think are impossible for you can probably just be done by putting in enough practice; whatever it is you want to learn, I'd say try giving it a few practice sessions before deciding whether it's impossible or not
Besides, if you're too scared to play anything besides things that you're confident are in your skill level, you might not make it very far.

Quote from: braixen1264 on August 26, 2017, 06:25:34 PMI think a lot of things you might think are impossible for you can probably just be done by putting in enough practice; whatever it is you want to learn, I'd say try giving it a few practice sessions before deciding whether it's impossible or not
Besides, if you're too scared to play anything besides things that you're confident are in your skill level, you might not make it very far.

That's true, thank you. Only way to succeed is to go forward I guess, so I'll pick up some more challenging stuff :)

Quote from: swimswamit on August 26, 2017, 07:45:18 AMI started piano in the first place and since summer's over i'll be able to start up piano lessons with my teacher again and really start making some progress. I've always liked your sheets but were always intimidated by ithem, but if I sit down and really work at it I think I'll be able to make some good progress on them. Thanks for the long answer, I really appreciate all the help you've been giving!

And it gives me great pleasure to help someone who's actually interested in my cause and the stuff that I do - so thank you for your enthusiasm, it's inspiring for me too :)

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Quote from: braixen1264 on August 26, 2017, 06:25:34 PMI think a lot of things you might think are impossible for you can probably just be done by putting in enough practice; whatever it is you want to learn, I'd say try giving it a few practice sessions before deciding whether it's impossible or not
Besides, if you're too scared to play anything besides things that you're confident are in your skill level, you might not make it very far.

Quote from: swimswamit on August 26, 2017, 07:49:17 PMThat's true, thank you. Only way to succeed is to go forward I guess, so I'll pick up some more challenging stuff :)

Braix makes a good point, and I'd just like to add on some ideas to that ^^

~

You can more-or-less divide sheets into three categories:
1. Short-term commitment sheets that are within your technical grasp
2. Sheets you've already mastered and/or are very comfortable with
3. Long-term commitment sheets that need constant effort and deliberate work over a long peroid to even execute properly from start to end

I think the perfect balance for your standard repertoire (i.e. playlist, except all live) is as many of category 1, about 3-6 of category 2, and 2-4 of category 3 :)

~
When I was still learning classical piano, the tradition was to keep a few long-term commitment "exam pieces" in your repertoire and just drill those week by week. I saw lots of my peers stuck on those exam pieces with very little progress over months, sometimes years. It's quite easy to burn out if the only pieces you can play are the ones that demand mundane drilling and intense focus - personally, when I was doing a performance competition, I'd played one particular piece so much that I hated it to the core, which is unfortunate, because it was really beautiful as long as I wasn't playing it :p

The trick is balance. Do keep drilling the tough pieces, but don't put down the easy pieces too quickly just because you've "mastered it". It helps to go back and play something you're familiar with from time to time. Better still, find one of two easy pieces to keep in your repertoire and work on getting those as perfect as possible. If it helps, here's my current repertoire:

Easy stuff: Route 209, Lilycove City, Rustboro Nighttime Jazz, some original works ^^
Tough stuff: Battle at the Summit, Tarrey Town, Mt. Chimney

Most of my piano time is spent drilling the tough pieces and quick-learning pieces for fast recordings, but I try to keep the number of technically challenging pieces I'm doing at 2-4, because I feel I'd burn out if too much time was spent working on mundane stuff. Yes, the mundane stuff is important - but as much as building technique is necessary, I believe it's even more crucial to avoid burnout and keep the passion alive. Therefore, the easy playlist ^^

So do try out the stuff that seems impossible and work dilligently at those, but don't forget to have some easy sheets you've already figured out in your pocket for the funsies :)

Hope this helps!~

Lilycove city is actually my favorite tune out of all of them, looks like I'll be sticking that on my list. I've definitely got some long distance goals, if I had to fill out the list you've given it'd probably look something like this currently:

1. Snowman, song of healing, possum springs.

2.Cara Mia, Silent Hill Promise (Reprise) and Not Tomorrow, Home Again, File Select (PMD: RRT), and some others I haven't played much in a while.

3. Twinleaf Town, Route 209, Lilycove City, It's Raining Elsewhere
And a long, long distance goal would be route 216, it's my favorite of yours.

I like the outline and I'll try to stick to this, will also be picking up lessons again and getting down to the nitty gritty with scales and hand exercies that should help (and I'll be learning some Beethoven) so I should be making some progress hopefully. Thanks :)

Hah I've just realized that I'm completely lacking in those first two categories that you've mentioned, so I should probably focus a bit more on those instead and really cut down on the long-term goals...

Maybe something like this could work?:

1. Route 209, Littleroot Town, Canalave City
2. N's Farewell, An Unwavering Heart
3. Approaching Champion Cynthia, National Park HGSS, Chopin Etude Op.25 No.5, Op.10 No.12

Quote from: swimswamit on August 27, 2017, 09:31:44 AMI've definitely got some long distance goals, if I had to fill out the list you've given it'd probably look something like this currently:

1. Snowman, song of healing, possum springs.

2.Cara Mia, Silent Hill Promise (Reprise) and Not Tomorrow, Home Again, File Select (PMD: RRT), and some others I haven't played much in a while.

3. Twinleaf Town, Route 209, Lilycove City, It's Raining Elsewhere
And a long, long distance goal would be route 216, it's my favorite of yours.

Looks like a good list! ^^ I feel that "Possum Springs" might be a little on the tough side, but I suppose it works based on just a few counting patterns which you can learn quite fast, so it should be okay~

As for "Route 216", it's one of those tracks that's mainly difficult because of its speed, but also rhythmically quite tough. I'm glad to hear you like it, but definitely keep that one on the bench for a little while more - honestly, I haven't fully mastered that sheet yet either xD

QuoteI like the outline and I'll try to stick to this, will also be picking up lessons again and getting down to the nitty gritty with scales and hand exercies that should help (and I'll be learning some Beethoven) so I should be making some progress hopefully. Thanks :)

Glad that this outline helps! :) And I hope the lessons turn out useful too~

Scales and hand exercises are good! But only work them with full focus, or not at all - they're the most efficient way to warm up and get used to common figurations, but nothing hides the fact that they're boring. That said, if your teacher has an approach to scales and arpeggios that doesn't involve insane boredom, do let me know ahaha :p

I reeeaaally don't recommend doing Beethoven early on in the learning phase, though. Even "Fur Elise", haha. I haven't seen you play yet, but judging by your VGM sheet choices, I'd recommend looking through the 6 Clementi sonatinas (opus thirty-something). They're a good primer to the mid-Classical style, and I think they're beautiful. Some movements are quite tough, but you should be able to tell that visually xD

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Quote from: braixen1264 on August 27, 2017, 11:52:23 PMHah I've just realized that I'm completely lacking in those first two categories that you've mentioned, so I should probably focus a bit more on those instead and really cut down on the long-term goals...

Maybe something like this could work?:

1. Route 209, Littleroot Town, Canalave City
2. N's Farewell, An Unwavering Heart
3. Approaching Champion Cynthia, National Park HGSS, Chopin Etude Op.25 No.5, Op.10 No.12

ahaha i see you let go of winter wind xD

This is a nice selection! :) For your long-term projects you have three short technical studies and one slightly more complex one (National Park ahaha, welp), and I personally like to balance my tough selections that way when not working for something major~

Quick aside - I think "N's Farewell" is one of the best pieces to keep in anyone's VGM piano repertoure. Even after you're done learning the sheet, it's just so dang fun to improvise on thatmelody, and it's just so well-written. ^^

I've almost finished a piece, but I'm having, and have had for years, issues on that last 5%. I can play the song with 90% accuracy, but those mistakes are rarely in the same place any time I play it.  Does anyone have tips on ironing out that last tiny bit? Most of this last bit involves a lot of leaps, so it's much harder to get simple muscle memory to take over.

What piece?

http://www.ninsheetmusic.org/download/pdf/3459

edit: but this also applies to just about every other sheet I've played and couldn't get to 100%, which is most of what I've done in the past few years

Do you know what's tripping you up?

My general diagnosis for this is one of three things:

1) It's not in your ear

2) It's not in your hands, technique-wise.

3) It's in your ear, and you're playing it, but the connection from hand to ear isn't there.

Try singing it while you play? Or is it specific technical issues?

My piano teacher would probably say slow down, without even knowing the problem

Quote from: Maelstrom on September 05, 2017, 12:31:35 PMI've almost finished a piece, but I'm having, and have had for years, issues on that last 5%. I can play the song with 90% accuracy, but those mistakes are rarely in the same place any time I play it.  Does anyone have tips on ironing out that last tiny bit? Most of this last bit involves a lot of leaps, so it's much harder to get simple muscle memory to take over.

Ooh, nice - this is a topic that's quite close to me. Here's what I've got:

In a general sense, there are two types of challenges when it comes to mechanically learning a piece: familiarisation/memory challenges and technical challenges (also includes musical challenges). Both require deliberate work if you'd like to practice (and eventually execute) your pieces efficiently. ^^

PDS summarises it pretty well:

Quote from: Pianist Da Sootopolis on September 05, 2017, 07:35:44 PM1) It's not in your ear

2) It's not in your hands, technique-wise.

3) It's in your ear, and you're playing it, but the connection from hand to ear isn't there.

1) and 3) are under "familiarisation challenges". These happen because you don't, simply, know the piece well enough, and are not ready to react fast enough when faced with the scenario of executing it in the moment.

The solution for these challenges is not to know the piece better as much as it is to know the piece on a deeper level. That's why they tell you to "go slow" - but don't just play slower: play it in time, firmly, basically with as many small details as you can fill into the space.

But the demands aren't really that high haha - usually, playing something slower and in time until you're comfortable is enough for you to internalise the notes. ^^

In summary, when faced with a familiarisation challege, take time to learn your piece in detail. In your "far" example, I forsee that the left-hand part can be hard to familiarise if you're good at guessing chords, but when you're using extra mental energy to guess the notes instead of actually knowing the notes, you might make mistakes that lead to a 90% performance every single time~

~

And 2) is the essence of a technical challenge: you just aren't skilled enough to play what's on the sheet, at your desired tempo, without slipping up most of the time.

Technical challenges require a lot more work to handle, of course - when I was working on performance quite seriously, my teacher would give me little tips on tiny things like finger attacks, elbow weight and small turns if I asked her "how do I play this part without sucking". And then I'd go home and work the techniques individually, detail by detail: if I was to learn finger attacks, I'd work staccato scales, then the passage with all accents at a super slow tempo, then the passage with altered rhythms...you get the idea xD

So a technical challenge is best faced with deliberate, detailed practice. You know, the most boring kinds of practice.

For your sheet, I think the octave melody in the last section is quite tough to hit consistently. If I was to learn this sheet, I'd spend some time playing just that octave melody: first, at a slower tempo, to make sure I'm entirely familiar with it, then build up the tempo as the details are ironed out. Along the way you're bound to find some passages or particular leaps that are really tough, so practice those separately (literally, two notes in isolation) and try to commit those to muscle memory. :)

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It's a frustrating feeling to keep working on something but not achieving the level you expect and not knowing why - so if you don't mind I'll try to infer a little ^^

I'm suspecting that for this "far" arrangement of yours, you're missing a "95% performance" (90+5, hehe) because of a combination of familiarisation and technical challenges that you haven't deliberately worked on yet.

For example, I'd think the line with bar 13 would need a bit of time to familiarise. Write the fingerings down, play that bit in isolation, all of that. The section at bar 17 on, I feel, is the hardest to execute on the spot, because you're making leaps in both hands on the second beat of most bars. I think, if I were to learn this, I'd spend most of the first twenty minutes familiarising that section.

Then I think I'd spend however much time I needed to secure the accuracy of that section, especially in the left hand. I think the left hand part is one of the bigger technical challenges of this piece, because your left thumb is basically doing octave leaps every bar (there's no better fingering I think :p). Of course, I'd use some time for the octave melody too - particularly in the links between beat 3 and 1, because those are accompanied with left-hand downward leaps.

~

Hope this helps! ^^ I wish I could spend more time asking you about your experiences instead of giving hard advice, but I'm not in the best of places to do that ahaha. Do let me know if anything though!~

I'll give this a shot today and see what's up. I can say for  sure the  problem is not #1. I listened to this song on and off for a few years before ever arranging it. I practiced it a lot last semester, and, you know, spend hours with it to arrange it. Oh, and the song is 90% memorized at this point. I'm coming to belive the problem might be tempo. I should also note the issues seem to lessen when playing with one hand; I can regularly perform the entire song, one hand only, at 98%, even with my eyes closed. And yes, that includes the RH in the 3rd section. Now that I think more, it has been more of the octave jumps for me. I may see if I can make a quick recording or something and PM a link to you so you can kinda see what I mean by this.

Edit: and the first section hasn't given me problems at all in ages.

The way I practice is as soon as I encounter a measure where I make a mistake, I'll slowly go over that measure(and the surrounding ones) a dozen times or so and try it again. Don't know if this is the best way to approach learning pieces, but it's worked for me :p

Something I've been pondering for a little while now is a good way to play the beginning section of SMW's Athletic theme. The way it's written on site right now doesn't really lend itself to being played at 300+ BPM due to repeating notes (i.e. see below, the RH plays two eighth note E's in a row several times), or at least that's why I have a problem with it. I don't really have a problem with anything else in the sheet (minus a couple of notes I cut in a place or two for simplicity), but when I try to play this section at full speed I just muddle through the notes in the chord keeping the contour of the notes roughly what they're supposed to be. Was wondering if anyone had a good way to write out this part for the right hand.

This is the first of several similar figures from this sheet here (http://www.ninsheetmusic.org/download/pdf/598).

(https://www.ninsheetmusic.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FS19IyDv.png&hash=e7ee5ec7ef1f569ee0e58e396418133651ffc3d3)

That particular passage (especially awkward in the key of A, where the repeated note is made harder to repeat because of your thumb having to hit the C#) requires a lot of intricate wrist work to support the finger repetitions.. Other than that, at 300 BPM, yikes!

You've just gotta be incredibly athletic

Gonna use two posts for two points! ^^ Keeping it organised ahaha

Quote from: Maelstrom on September 06, 2017, 05:11:07 AMI'll give this a shot today and see what's up. I can say for  sure the  problem is not #1. I listened to this song on and off for a few years before ever arranging it. I practiced it a lot last semester, and, you know, spend hours with it to arrange it. Oh, and the song is 90% memorized at this point. I'm coming to belive the problem might be tempo. I should also note the issues seem to lessen when playing with one hand; I can regularly perform the entire song, one hand only, at 98%, even with my eyes closed. And yes, that includes the RH in the 3rd section. Now that I think more, it has been more of the octave jumps for me. I may see if I can make a quick recording or something and PM a link to you so you can kinda see what I mean by this.

Edit: and the first section hasn't given me problems at all in ages.

I'd love to hear a recording, yeah! ^^ If you could shoot your hands up close (from an above-keys angle) that'll really help too, maybe I could try to point out some minor details~

From what I've gathered in text though, it sounds like you've been doing quite a bit of work of each of the parts in isolation, but less so of the parts together - this was one of the habits I had when I refused to go at a slower tempo, not sure if it's a thing for you too. Either way, unless a part is particularly tricky on one hand, I don't see too much use in practising separately. The only part I'd work on separate hands is the octave melody, for your sheet~

It works on the same rationale as playing a contrary motion scale - you need to know your left hand scale and right hand scale individually, but once you know both of those, you take an entirely different mindset into learning the contrary motion techniques ^^

Anyway, looking forward to that recording! :)

~

Quote from: braixen1264 on September 06, 2017, 07:02:12 PMThe way I practice is as soon as I encounter a measure where I make a mistake, I'll slowly go over that measure(and the surrounding ones) a dozen times or so and try it again. Don't know if this is the best way to approach learning pieces, but it's worked for me :p

I think this is a pretty efficient way to practice! :) For most sheets that don't pose super big technical challenges, I learn them this way ;)

One extra tip though - if the sheet is any tougher than sight-reading difficulty, practice by section. Most sheets do come with some form of technical challenge, but these technical challenges are either isolated (eg. flourishes and licks) or kept within sections (eg. riffs and ostinatos). For pieces with circular structures where sections tend to repeat, this significantly cuts learning time ^^

For example, you mentioned you were learning Chopin's Revolutionary Etude! ^^ The rough structure of that is Intro-A-B-C (based on Intro)-A1-Coda. You could learn this straight through, but if you chop it into sections and work them one by one, I think it compartmentalises your mind to associate the repetitions with each other much better, and at least when I know my structure first I do a lot less work - do give it a spin! :)

Quote from: Latios212 on September 06, 2017, 07:53:09 PMSomething I've been pondering for a little while now is a good way to play the beginning section of SMW's Athletic theme. The way it's written on site right now doesn't really lend itself to being played at 300+ BPM due to repeating notes (i.e. see below, the RH plays two eighth note E's in a row several times), or at least that's why I have a problem with it. I don't really have a problem with anything else in the sheet (minus a couple of notes I cut in a place or two for simplicity), but when I try to play this section at full speed I just muddle through the notes in the chord keeping the contour of the notes roughly what they're supposed to be. Was wondering if anyone had a good way to write out this part for the right hand.

This is the first of several similar figures from this sheet here (http://www.ninsheetmusic.org/download/pdf/598).

(https://www.ninsheetmusic.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FS19IyDv.png&hash=e7ee5ec7ef1f569ee0e58e396418133651ffc3d3)

ahaha...you could even dream of doing this at full speed, and meanwhile i gave up at 170 </3

This section though!! >< I really agree with what you said, especially with the way you phrased it: this section is definitely playable, but it does not lend itself into being played at a rushed tempo. At all. There's a different between "fast" and "rushed": "Bonetrousle" is fast and "Gourmet Race" is rushed, as a frikkin brilliant example (that i will use every time from this post onwards bwahaha i just found a brilliant example off my head <3)

If you want something rushed, it really helps to cut on the leaps and jumps. So in that vein of thought, the left hand could definitely be reduced~

...I digress. xD How I'd write this section is:
A-A-E-G-C#/A-E | A-C#-E-C#/A

Basically, cut all chords to two notes, and only keep the ones that are on off-beats. The on-beats will naturally emphasise themselves, especially since they all happen to be on either the root or 5th of the chord. So with that rhythmic and harmonic accent I don't really see a need for a textural (i.e. vertical number of notes) accent~

I'd still struggle to play it in the way I suggested though, because of the G-A on 4-5...but I suppose there's no way around that xD

So, I don't know if we have any jazz masters here on the forum, but I'm having difficulty sounding like Herbie Hancock does and it's a bit frustrating.

..wow, now that I type that out, I sound ridiculous.

No, but really. I'm playing his solo on One Finger Snap (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KT4bvp9mGRc), and once I leave the transcription, I can never really get my own lines to sound remotely like his when I'm soloing. What should I do?

Quote from: daj on September 08, 2017, 07:12:58 AMA-A-E-G-C#/A-E | A-C#-E-C#/A

Basically, cut all chords to two notes, and only keep the ones that are on off-beats. The on-beats will naturally emphasise themselves, especially since they all happen to be on either the root or 5th of the chord. So with that rhythmic and harmonic accent I don't really see a need for a textural (i.e. vertical number of notes) accent~

I'd still struggle to play it in the way I suggested though, because of the G-A on 4-5...but I suppose there's no way around that xD

Perfect! That was exactly what I was going for (and sorta thinking of, but not really solidified). Thanks for confirming that in my mind ;D

...and haha, yeah. Time to get my fourth finger to actually work.

~~~

Concerning the left hand, how un-sloppily I play it just depends on how I'm feeling that day xD I normally play it at a bit under tempo, but it's certainly fun to try at full speed :P maybe I can assemble a recording sometime I'm having an "on" day.

You have "on" days? I'm jealous